What are your initial reactions to the novel so far? Did any of your predictions come true so far? What is your take on Guy Montag? Clarisse? Mildred? Bradbury's writing style?
Choose a passage, and write your thoughts. You don't have to answer all of those questions-- they are just ideas to get you going. You can ask your own question and try to answer it, make a connection, or deliberate on a BIG idea that you see emerging. It's up to you.
Just make sure that you include the passage, page number, and your thoughts/questions/reflection. Also, make sure that you respond to someone else's comment.
What happened that society has changed so much?
ReplyDelete"It's only one-third of my yearly pay". Two thousand dollars. Two thousand dollars is one third of his yearly pay. That makes his yearly salary six thousand dollars a year. The average American salary is about 60,528 dollars per year, according to the 2004 cencus. Obviously the whole, "reading is illegal" thing made me wonder this, but the question slipped out of my mind until I read this. What most caught my attention is that it seems as if for them, 6,000 a year isn't too bad. He mentions how "it's fine work" (6). This hints that whatever caused this dystopic society had to do with money. At least that's what I imagine.
“We get these cases nine or ten a night. Got so many a starting a few years ago, we had these special machines built… You don’t need an M.D., case like this; all you need is two handymen, clean up the problem in half an hour. Look… we gotta go. Just got another call on the old ear thimble. Ten blocks from here, someone just jumped off the cap of a pillbox.” (15)
ReplyDeleteA big idea that seems to already be emerging, is one greatly similar to that seen in “The Veldt”- The idea that great advancements in technology can be damaging to the human population, and can contribute to major shifts in ethical views. This quote begs to ask the question, why are so many people in this society and time in the future so suicidal? The “handymen” in this passage tell Guy that so many people call in reporting cases of suicide, that special machines have been created just to help resolve this. The machines are capable of doing all the work, therefore only “handymen” are needed, not even an M.D. But WHY exactly is suicide a recurring problem in this futuristic setting? Does it have something to do with the technological advancements happening at this time? It is clear that in this futuristic world, books are being burned- something we would never imagine during present times- could this be a major damaging factor? Obviously many people are extremely unhappy, depressed. Although only 21 pages into this book, it clear that technology and ethical values in the futuristic setting have greatly shifted from what they are as we know them.
I definitely agree. Bradbury clearly seems to be getting at the idea that new innovations and technology is not always positive and that it in fact can have a very negative response or consequence. People often think of new technology as an amazing thing, but he continues to challenge this with the question of "how much is too much?"
DeleteWhy does Montag muses about this seventeen year old crazy girl, when he gets home?
ReplyDelete"He looked at the blank wall. The girl's face was there, really quite beautiful in memory"(10)
As I was reading, this part stood out to me because it really shows how interested Montag is in this girl, the fact that he actually pictures her on the wall right when he gets home show how amazed he was by her. It made me question what was it about her that got him like that. I think that she fascinated him with her outrageous questions, She asks him if he is happy and then disappears into her house, this definitely catches his attention. Clarisse’s strangeness makes Montag very nervous, and he laughs repeatedly which shows how nervous he is. This clearly shows that Montag is interested in this girl even though he already has a wife.
You made a really good point, but I don't necissarily agree with you about the fact that he likes Clarrise in a romantic way. I think he definitely admires her in an unusual way, but as I wrote in my blog post, I think that he likes her so much because she is what he wishes he could be.
DeleteI agree with you, Elana because I don't think Guy likes Clarisse. Guy might be fascinated with her because she makes him feel happy, obvisouly, he is not already. This relates back to at the end when Guy was talking to his wife and asked her if her story had a happy ending. He might have just been looking for someone to talk to and be happy with.
DeleteI agree. Montag seems to be interested in her. She seemed to stand out to him. Clarisse must have sensed that Montag wasn't happy. Perhaps Montag isn't so happy anymore because of his wife. After all, she did overdose on sleeping pills. But, maybe Clarisse was just trying to lift his mood since he probably didn't seem happy to her.
Delete"How rarely did other people's faces take of you and throw back to you your own expression, your own intermost trembling thoughts." (8)
ReplyDeleteI believe that Montag is truly depressed. After his thought provoking talk with Clarrise, it is clear that he is unsure of his place in the world and is reevaluating who he is. I think that the reason he is so intrigued by Clarisse is that he realizes that she is able to state and ask everything that he is too afraid to. He admires this about her and wants to hear more of her thoughts. He is afraid to question the quality of life that his society provides him with, but Clarisse is not. It seems that she is the first person he has met that has asked all of these insane questions so straight-forwardly. She is not afraid to question authority, and Montag only wishes he was as courageous as her.
Elana, I agree and also touched on this with my post. Their conversation really sparked a change in the way Montag sees the world and made him more unsatisfied with the world around him. However, I don't think he is envious of this sense of curiosity, I actually think he is fearful of it. These thoughts and questions are challenging the importance of technology and are considered dangerous in that time period. I think Montag is very aware of the danger he would put himself in if he followed the same path as Clarisse, and will try to hide these new thoughts, not publicize them.
DeleteAdding on to Kenneth's post, Montag's conversation with Clarisse made him have a new view on his life. He now questions life and wonders what standpoint he is at. He is afraid of the society he lives in not only because he is afraid to question authority, as you said, but he is also plainly afraid of consequence and what will happen if he turns on society.
Delete"He wore his happiness like a mask and the girl had run off across the lawn with the mask..."
ReplyDeleteAfter Clarisse and Guy walk home together, it sparks a realization in Guy that he is not in fact content with his life. Though in the beginning, Montag seemed fairly positive, after the conversation Guy becomes slightly depressed; his home and wife are portrayed as very drab and melancholy in his eyes. My prediction is that Guy will become some kind of outlier from the rest of society because of his dislike for all the new technology around him. And it all begins with his interaction with Clarisse, who's curiosity and constant questioning trigger new dangerous thoughts of his own.
Is Montag really happy? Is he hiding his real feelings from people?
ReplyDeleteI ask myself this question because when clarisse askes him "are you happy" he responds "of course im happy. What does she think." To me this stood out beacuse usually when people ask if your happy its because your expressions may not show it. Then later it says"he felt his smile slide away, melt fold over and down on itself like a tallow skin, like the stuff of a fantastic candle burning too long and now collapsing and now blown out.Darkeness. He was not happy" (12). This made think that maybe he is not happy and hes just putting up a fake smile so that people wont think hes depress.
Although I don't think that Montag is fake-smiling, I do think that Clarisse asking him if he is happy is mysterious. Clarisse is an weird girl, and I think she is somehow connected to what happened to Mildred.
DeleteI see what you are saying and I agree. I see Montag as an unstable person, especially with all of the observations he makes and the connections that he creates to tell the reader what his is thinking about. His fake smile is to make himself feel better because he wants to believe that he is okay and stable but with these hidden emotions, I don't think he can control his emotions but I do not believe he is depressed. I believe that he is just a bit lost and out of it.
Delete'"Yes," he said... "You took all the pills last night."'
ReplyDelete'"Oh, I wouldn't do a thing like that", she said. "Why would I do a thing like that."' (19)
Why is Mildred lying? Already in this book, couple of conflict beginning to show, but I find this one significant. Mildred must have taken all those pills, but why is she lying? Was she set up? I think Mildred didn't take all those pills, but some made her take them . She is not the only one who had to deal with this. The medical team states that there had been 9 or 10 of these calls a night. I think the trust in technology is fooling everyone that there might be unlawful activities going on. Also, right before Montag came home , Clarisse asked him if he was happy. Is Clarisse connected to this?
I agree that the circumstances of this event were a bit suspicious. But maybe Mildred really did just forget that she took the pills. But then again, it is really weird that Clarisse out of the blue asks Montag if he's happy, and then this happens to his wife. Maybe she is somehow involved or connected.
DeleteThey walked still farther and the girl said, "Is it true that long ago firemen put fires out instead of going to start them?"
ReplyDelete"No. Houses have always been fireproof, take my word for it."
"Strange. I heard once that a long time ago houses used to burn by accident and they needed firemen to stop the flames."
He laughed.
(8)
I found this quote interesting because obviously, now, firemen are used for putting out fires. Ray Bradbury paints this image for the reader of a dystopic type age, where firemen are starting fires. In my eyes, fires are obviously scary and it isn't often that I see one. I also, as well as most people, think/picture firemen as heroes, those who stop the flames and danger that comes along with them. Clarisse McClellan also has this insight on the firemen that seems normal to us, but not even the fireman knows, since he denies it then laughs. This gives the reader the knowledge about Clarisse and that she's special (and that idea might come back in the book later).
I totally agree with you about the fact that Clarisse will be an important character in the book because Guy Montag actually fell in love with her as he states in the novel when he meets her. "He looked at a blank wall. The girl's face was there. Really quite beautiful in memory: astonishing, in fact." (8) It seems as if Montag fell in love with Clarisse and she might be the key in the novel. The fact that she believes that firemen aren't supposed to start fires and that they are supposed to extinguish them delineates that she is the key into unlocking this despotic society. Now that Montag and Clarisse have a connection they might turn this despotic world into something brighter and more positive.
DeleteI agree with the points you made. To add on, it does seem like the society that the book takes place in is repressive and somehow wants to control information and wipe out history (through the burning of books?) We do not yet know what the controlling power wants to do, but in its controlling manner, we see how the population has become ignorant, and blinded. I am just inferring, but from the small bits of information read thus far in the book, it seems like this is the type of society in which all the people are told the same thing, and must conform to a certain set of rules, and possibly faces consequences for not following the masses.
DeleteI totally agree on with what you are saying. To add on, I think that Ray Bradbury is trying to say that their society is on fire. A fire is something that is dangerous, but also hard to control because it spreads. I could compare this to their society because throughout the story, there are machines and and there are burning books. This means that there is no knowledge in this society. Burning Books= no knowledge and technology=laziness. This society is clearly corrupted.
Delete"Its only two thousand dollars. That's one third of my yearly pay. Its only two thousand dollars." (18)
ReplyDeleteI noticed that there are many occurrences when Ray Bradbury gets too repetitive to prove a point. The language that Bradbury uses in this novel is very repetitive and it's like the characters do not understand what is going on around them, and they act extremely selfish. Another example of the repetition is when Guy enters the room where his wife was and the author writes "Darkness. He was not happy. He was not happy." (9) The language signifies that there is no actual resemblance of positivity in the world because everything is so dull and dark. The language is scary and signifies that the narrator is not happy with his life. Everything is so strange in Guy's life and it makes me feel very uncomfortable reading this book because I am not used to reading such strange novels like this.
'"You know, I'm not afraid of you at all"'. (7)
ReplyDeleteThroughout the passage, Clarisse is very on edge. She is always blathering out random stuff. For example at one point she says that she's 17 and that she likes to look and smell things. Usually those two statements don't go together. This has made me notice what I believe to be Bradbury's style of writing. He likes to write with a conflict, with major confusion. It takes time to understand what is actually happening in his writing.
"Is it true that long ago firemen put fires out instead of going to start them?"
ReplyDeleteFrom the first 21 pages, it seemed interesting that Clarisse McClellan always kept saying "Do you know?" and then says something about the past, or what used to happen. I think that she knows something, or many things, about the past and isn't being clear about it. She might be hinting to something important to Guy, maybe about his job. I also found it interesting that on page 7 Clarisse says that she's crazy. She might not be crazy, but she just knows things that other people might not know.
I agree with you and I feel like Clarisse definitely knows something that other people don't and when she finally tells Guy it will change his perspective on life and the world. She seems very unusual especially the way she talks and her family too. The part where Guy is going back home and he talks about how there is laughter coming from her house and how late at night while every other house is shrouded in darkness hers is brightly lit.
DeleteI agree with you i thought this was interesting. I would like to also add that she referred to her Uncle multiple times. She is the only link between the modern and the past worlds. She also seems to know a lot about what used to happen and she questions a lot of what s happening currently. I really enjoy this character and the way she thinks and speaks. About the "I'm crazy" part i think she is not really crazy since crazy is a relative term. In this time period and society she is different and that seems crazy to others.
Delete"The autumn leaves blew over the moonlit pavement in such a way as to make the girl who was moving there seems fixed to a sliding walk, letting the motion of the wind and the leaves carry her forward. Her face was slender and milk-white, and in it was a kind of gentle hunger that touched over everything with tireless curiosity. The dark eyes were so fixed to the world that no move escaped them. Her dress was white and it whispered. He almost thought he heard the motion of her hands as she walked, and the infinitely small sound now." (5)
ReplyDeleteThis really stood out to me the way Clarisse was described because it sounded angelic. She's just this seventeen year old girl who was walking along a pavement in the middle of the night which got me thinking about her true motives and who she actually is. In the blurb it talks about how Guy Montag never questioned anything until he met Clarisse so it's almost as if she was sent to him. Of course not literally sent to him but maybe she serves a greater purpose in his life.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDelete"No. Houses have always been fireproof, take my word for it."
ReplyDeleteThis passage stood out to me because, to me, it shows how their society is corrupted. That's because it's like a fire, something that spreads a lot and hard to keep in control. Their society is corrupted because they have to much technology and they burn books. To much technology means that society is very lazy and burning books means that there is no knowledge and knowledge is being disrespected. We gain knowledge out of books, but if you are burning books then you will get no knowledge. Ray Bradbury shows that it's very hard to control this fire.
To add on to your point, it's almost like their society is trying to wipe out all knowledge of the past so that the people may not rise up and against them .This could be a explanation to why they are ignorant to the fact that firemen put out fire instead of making them. However it is apparent that they are not completely successful in making everyone ignorant by the fact that people such as Clarisse still wonder about it. At the same time the only reason why Clarisse questions it is because she doesn't follow this society's norms, saying herself that she is crazy.
DeleteWhy does Clarisse question Montag's happiness? What makes Montag think happiness is nonsense?
ReplyDeleteJust when Clarisse was about to go into her house, she suddenly asked Montag if he was happy. Montag seemed to think it was a silly question and wondered why she would even ask it. However, when he entered his room, he realized that he wasn't happy. He faked his happiness. Perhaps he wasn't happy because of his wife. When Montag's wife didn't remember what had happened the night before, he didn't tell her the truth. Instead, he lied to her. But perhaps he did it to keep her happy.
I definitely agree with you. When Guy says that he wore his happiness as a mask and she took the mask, it really proved to me that his life may be a lie. I think that he tries to make the people around him happy but that makes him upset.
DeleteI think its very clear to Clarrise that Montag is unhappy because he seems very closed off and on the edge during there entire conversation. To Clarisse who seems to be bubbly i' m assuming she gets the feeling that he is s very closed off and unattached which could be signs of unhappiness.
Delete"Without turning on the light he imagined how this room would look. His wife stretched on the bed, uncovered and cold, like a body displayed on the lid of a tomb, her eyes fixed to the ceiling by invisible threads of steel, immovable." (12)
ReplyDeleteThis quote makes me believe that Montag is the kind of guy to not just anticipate actions but also observe things he sees very closely. The way he speaks of Mildred hints that Montag is very observant but, the authors writing style shows repetition of certain points to emphasize a feeling or observation of somebody. Just going back to Montag, he is found many times making these observations and feeling the need to make comparisons and create comparisons. These literary devices create a deeper meaning in his observations and seem to be hinting that Montag's observant qualities may lead to further problems.
I completely agree with you. Montag appears to observe things deeply, and assume things without taking a second look at them. This quote shows that as well saying how he is very descriptive (sign of authors craft). If you were to add onto this I'd say go deeper with the last sentence you wrote. That can have a huge impact on not just Montag, but many other people in his "world"" he is in.
DeleteI definitely agree with what you said about Montag anticipating things a lot and being very observant. I think how Ray Bradbury writes about it, in the beginning of the book, foreshadows the many events/ conflicts that Montag is going to have with the distopian society he lives in, throughout the book. Also, to add on, I think the things he says about how he smiles, and how he is always smiling, shows his awareness to things that he does, that seem a little strange. This also leads me to talk about the curiosity he might be having, and how this will impact his actions in the distopian society.
Deleteif only someone else's flesh and brain and memory. if only they could have taken her mind along to the dry cleaner's and emptied the pockets..." (16)
ReplyDeletethis passage stood out to me because Montag's desire for his wife to be changed and come back as a new person is an exact contradiction to what Holden wanted with the glass cases- illustrating his desire to have people remain the same. this passage also stood out to me because until now, Montag had not shown any signs of wanting things to change in his life. in the beginning of the story he was talking about how much he loved his job and as I read on it became clear that he never questioned it. However slowly the realization that there is something wrong came to him as he realized that he wasn't happy with something in his life- even feeling incomplete to the point of listening in on Clarisse's private life with her family. After Guy mentioned that he wanted his wife changed it really stood out then that he was not just unhappy with his wife but with something about the rest of his society.
" He wore his happiness like a mask and the girl had run off across the lawn with the mask and there was no way of going to knock on her door and ask for it back."
ReplyDelete(pg. 12)
Throughout the book, so far, I was very lost on the setting and where it is taking place. At first I thought the story was taking place in a distopian society, where the buildings were fire proof, his smile never went away, and there weren't feelings towards one another. After reading this line, and how Montag describes this girl it seems like his feelings towards her aren't allowed, in some way. I think Montag literally wears his happiness like a mask, because like I said before, he says it never goes away. Then this girl comes along and somehow takes it away, without seeming to do anything. Montag seemed to like this girl and when she went home that made him upset because he had strong feelings towards her, in just a short amount of time. In my opinion, I think this quote and him meeting the girl will lead to the beginning of many uncertainties throughout the book.
I think the reason that Bradbury says Clarisse took Guy Montag's happiness and ran away with it is because she made him think. She was asking him questions that he had never thought about before. Montag seems to be almost blinded by the government, that he works for burning books, that he sees nothing else and asks no questions. Clarisse however wants to read the books and wonders what the past was like and questions Montags happiness which he had not done before.
Delete"Someone else's blood there. If only someone else's flesh and brain and memory" (14).
ReplyDeleteI fell this quote (and passage) stands out to me because it shows how Montag wants his wife to be changed but still alive. He cares about her of course but might not be able to stand for the slight change and able to accept she's the same. Montag wants her to be herself, but might not be able to handle this is the same person he once loved, which can show he is unhappy with his life and maybe even the people around him. Before this he walks a girl named Clarisse and shuts her down when she questions his job as a firefighter. He doesn't like his society; if he did he wouldn't shut her down like he did. It was such a small thing. Anyways, back to the original quote. He must care about his wife, or they wouldn't be together, but there must be something that wants her to change so badly. He must want his life or just his wife to change because of something in his past, or just being unhappy.
"He felt his smile slide away, melt, fold over and down on itself like a tallow skin, like the stuff of a fantastic candle burning too long and now collapsing and now blown down. Darkness. He was not happy. He was not happy." (pg. 12)
ReplyDeleteThis line stands out to me because this girl, Clarisse, helped Guy realize that he wasn't happy, without knowing him. Clarisse seems to notice things that other people usually don't. She also questions things that others don't. But why question Guy's happiness? In my opinion, Clarisse sees past Guy's laughter and notices that he might also be curious about the past and if things were always a certain way and he might not actually be happy with what life is like.
I totally agree. I talked about this in my blog. I think he does not want to admit that hes not happy or maybe he think hes happy when hes not. Also, I think clarrise is a curious person because while they are walking she askes questions about the past.
Delete"How rarely do other people's faces take of you and throw back to you your own expression, your own innermost trembling thoughts?..." (11)
ReplyDeleteThis quote foreshadows into a scene later in the book, prior to this scene Clarise McClellan asks Montag if hes happy and the fact that she asks him catches him off guard. When Montag comes home he finds his wife in the house passed out from overdosing on pills, this is the scene that is foreshadowed by the quote. From what i've gathered Montag is unhappy with his living conditions at home and Clarisse sees through that which is what draws him to her so instantly and later causes him to think about her even when he is not with her.
Something I noticed while reading this book is that Ray Bradbury uses a lot of personification in these first twenty pages or so. On the first page, he says that the books "died", and on page four, he talks about the "breath" of apricots and strawberries. On page eleven he also says that the sky "screamed". I find it interesting that the author chooses to do this because the main character so far, Guy Montag's job is burning books, inanimate objects, and so giving all these non - human things human characteristics makes his job seem almost more like murder. Another part of the book so far that stood out to me was the quote, "'You think too many things,' said Montag, uneasily." (pg. 6) This stood out to me because I thought, "Why is it a bad thing to think about too many things?" Is this dystopian world so messed up that people aren't even allowed to "think too much"? I wonder what counts as "too much". I hope these questions are answered as we continue with the book.
ReplyDeleteI agree with this statement . I feel that people are being restricted by someone or something greater in power. The author does a good job in making you think about the actual meaning in burning books and how it ties into messing with people's thought process. Take Guy's wife for example , being unaware that she's been overdosing on pills may tie into the restrictions on books . Has the law really gone as far to dictate every human idea?
Delete"Do you ever read any of the books you burn?' He laughed 'That's against the law!' 'Oh of course"
ReplyDeleteThis part of the book really stood out to me. This is where Guy Montag is talking to Clarisse, this reveals the dystopian society that the book is set in. Guy Montag seems to be part of this future government although he seems to question it towards the end of the reading where he almost wants to be a part of Clarisse's family and questions and gets mad at all the strangers that just come in and force things upon him. Montag is a fireman, he burns books. In this society there seems to be an overarching government that censors and controls what it's people see. Clarisse I believe will the be the character who helps Montag see and question the government that he has devoted himself and you can see this where she asks him if ever reads the books because that is something that she would do.
Why is Mildred reading a script if reading is forbidden?
ReplyDeleteWhy did she overdose on pills?
Is her health bad or good?
Will Clarisse influence Montag or is he just going to open his eyes to something he already knew he wanted to do?
pretty confused
"Lit a last candle and there had been a brief hour of rediscovery... and drew comfortably around them" (7).
Guy's reference to a flickering candle while describing Clarisse reveals that he viewed the fire and Clarisse as a gentle light. Montag deflects the question she asks, did firemen stop fires before they were called to start them? With this flash back i wondered why did he need to look back on this specific moment? It can be the reason he became a fireman. This futuristic world with fireproof homes and no books leaves the reader to see that these people are unintelligent idiots that burn books as a community service. Clarisse i observe is very curious and smart. She asks at the end of their encounter, are you happy? I thought this embodied the whole conflict Montag is going to deal with now because he truly is not. She is slowly opening his eyes.
'"Do you ever read any of the books you burn?"
ReplyDeleteHe laughed. "That's against the law! " oh of course. "' pg. 8
Within reading the first few pages I began to question what led up to this drastic measure . If reading is illegal and people seem to have adjusted to this synical norm why do people such as the girl Guy encountered still question it? I feel as if a change is going to come later on in the book in correlation to this first meeting . Not only did the girl open up possible thoughts that Guy had probably not come across before but foreshadowed a rebellion. While Guy seems to think everything is fine the way it is the girl still thinks about the past and seems to know more than she is letting Guy know.